We still have 2 more rescuers to be deposed, which is Chris Keys and myself in the case United Sates vs. Rusty Thomas et al. The dates are set for sometime in late August. We covet your prayers as we speak boldly as we should in the cause of Christ and the little ones made in His image we seek to defend and end the America holocaust.
As you go through the questions and study our answers, please take note that God’s word is being unsheathed and sent right into the belly of the beast. They think we are on trial, but it is their wicked tyranny that is on trial. They believe they will render a verdict against us when their human gavel falls, but there is another gavel that will fall and a more authoritative verdict will be rendered by the King of kings and the Lord of lords.
At that appointed time, it will be made clear for all eternity, that the United States government was the lawless one, while the rescuers were the law keepers (Mark 3:4).
1. Identify with specificity everyone who provided information used in preparing the response to these interrogatories, request for production of documents and requests for admission; and for each individual listed, state the individual’s address, telephone number, and identify each and every response for which the listed individual provided information.
ANSWER: Rusty Lee Thomas and my attorney, Vince Hueser
2. Identify with specificity the “history and persons” shared by Operation Save America and Operation Rescue, as referenced in Defendant’s response to paragraph 5 of the Complaint.
ANSWER: I became involved with Operation Rescue in the fall of 1988 and now I’m the national director of Operation Save America. As to the legal matters, I’m not fully aware of all the exact legal processes.
3. Were you arrested in Louisville, Kentucky, at or near EMW Women’s Surgical Center, on May 13, 2017?
4. ANSWER: Yes
4. Identify your intentions at or near the time you sat down in front of EMW, on May 13, 2017. In this response, specify the following:
a. Did you intend to prevent a person from receiving an abortion or abortion-related service at EMW, on May 13, 2017?
b. Did you intend to prevent a person from providing an abortion or abortion-related service at EMW, on May 13, 2017?
c. If your intentions were accomplished, identify with specificity, what was accomplished.
ANSWER: A) Not directly. B) At the front door, it was not us blocking the door, but the clinic deathscorts. We sat down in front of them. The back door was available to enter as well. C) As a result of this intervention, one life was indeed saved. To the life spared, we give God the glory. Besides that our goal was accomplished, which was to provide a Christian example of the doctrine of interposition for Gov. Bevin and to the state government of Kentucky.
Bevin’s motive to make Kentucky abortion-free is good. His actions, however, are insufficient to end the injustice and suffering of the preborn children made in the image of God. Gov. Bevin used the language of those who advocate for the murder of the preborn by treating abortion as a healthcare issue. We went to the abortion mill to remind him abortion is not a healthcare issue that can be resolved by a legal technicality. It is a crime. It is called murder and it needs to be penalized by law.
God demands justice, if the states and our nation will ever be delivered from the doctrine of blood guiltiness. Bevin and every state civil magistrate’s duty before God are to interpose and end all abortion from chemical to surgical on the state level. They need the courage of their conviction to say no to the federal government that unleashed this blood lust and hell upon our nation. They must uphold their sworn duty to protect the life, liberty, and property of Kentucky citizens, born and preborn.
The checks and balances of our federal government have disappeared for years. The states must place the constitutional chain to reapply those checks and balances back on the federal government to rein in their long train of abuses.
5. Identify whether you have been arrested at or within 50 feet of a facility that provides abortions or abortion-related services, and for each arrest, specify the date, charge, location, case number, and resolution of the arrest.
ANSWER: Too numerous to recall.
6. Describe with specificity your understanding of the Doctrine of Interposition, identify how it applies to ending abortion, and identify any actions taken at or near EMW, on May 13, 2017, which exemplified your understanding of the “Doctrine of Interposition” in Kentucky.
ANSWER: The doctrine of interposition clearly stated takes place when a tyrant, bully, or stronger entity (Federal government) targets the weak and helpless (Preborn child) for harm and a third party (Christians) stands between them to protect the victim.
Our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, provided the ultimate example of interposition. He stood on the cross between mankind’s 3 fold enemy, the world, the flesh, and the devil to save those who would repent of their sin and place their faith in Christ. He died and rose again to redeem His people by His blood and transform them by the power of the Holy Spirit.
An example from American history is the interposition that took place between the Underground Railroad and the appalling practice of slavery. Christians back then interposed to rescue their black brothers and sisters oppressed by a federal government that under the color of law enslaved them. The Supreme Court and the federal judiciary played the tyrant back then and were in extreme violation of our own Declaration of Independence and Constitution.
In the 1850’s, the Wisconsin legislature and the State Supreme Court demonstrated interposition in the Joshua Glover/Sherman Booth incident. They both defied the federal government regarding slavery and the unjust Fugitive Slave Act. This included defying the U. S. Supreme Court. They stated in part, “Resolved: That this assumption of jurisdiction by the federal judiciary, in the said case, and without process, is an act of undelegated power, and therefore without authority, void, and of no force.” – The Wisconsin Legislature, 1859
The same court that violated the liberty of our black citizens yesteryear is the same court today that violates the life of American children in the womb. They were in grave error back then and the same court and all who support their unjust, immoral, and unconstitutional decision to decriminalize abortion are in grave error today.
7. Describe with specificity your understanding of what it means to rescue, in the context of ending abortion, and identify any actions taken at or near EMW, on May 13, 2017, which exemplified your understanding “rescue,” in the context of ending abortion.
ANSWER: Proverbs 24:11, 12 states, “Rescue those being led away to death; hold back those staggering toward slaughter. If you say, “But we knew nothing about this,” does not he who weighs the heart perceive it? Does not he who guards your life know it? Will he not repay everyone according to what they have done?”
In legal terms, the call to rescue would be exemplified by the necessity defense. A citizen is walking alongside a fence. On the other side of the fence is a pool. A child falls into the pool and is drowning. Though the sign on the fence clearly states, “No Trespassing” a higher law demands the rescue of the drowning child.
All the law and the prophets are summed up into two great commandments. We are to love God with all our hearts, mind, soul, and strength and to love our neighbor as ourselves. Our preborn neighbor is being led to slaughter. We have neighbors, parents, which are considering doing the unspeakable to their own sons and daughters. We have neighbors, abortionists, who are putting their hand to commit a brutal crime for blood money. We have other neighbors, citizens, who are calloused, indifferent, and blinded to the plight of their neighbors. We must love them all enough to tell them the Gospel truth that has the power to rescue them and set them free.
8. Describe with specificity your understanding of what it means to stand in the gap, in the context of ending abortion, and identify any actions taken at or near EMW, on May 13, 2017, which exemplified your understanding of standing in the gap, in the context of ending abortion.
ANSWER: Ezekiel 22:25-31 declares, “The conspiracy of her prophets in her midst is like a roaring lion tearing the prey; they have devoured people; they have taken treasure and precious things; they have made many widows in her midst. Her priests have violated My law and profaned My holy things; they have not distinguished between the holy and unholy, nor have they made known the difference between the unclean and the clean; and they have hidden their eyes from My Sabbaths, so that I am profaned among them. Her princes in her midst are like wolves tearing the prey, to shed blood, to destroy people, and to get dishonest gain. Her prophets plastered them with untempered mortar, seeing false visions, and divining lies for them, saying, ‘Thus says the Lord GOD,’ when the LORD had not spoken. The people of the land have used oppressions, committed robbery, and mistreated the poor and needy; and they wrongfully oppress the stranger. So I sought for a man among them who would make a wall, and stand in the gap before Me on behalf of the land, that I should not destroy it; but I found no one. Therefore I have poured out My indignation on them; I have consumed them with the fire of My wrath; and I have recompensed their deeds on their own heads,” says the Lord GOD.”
The prophets, priests, princes, rulers, and the citizens of Israel all became corrupt, unjust, oppressive, and lawless. God called for someone to stand in the gap and make up the hedge to prevent His wrath from being poured out on their heads.
He doesn’t call for someone to sing about the gap, write about the gap, preach about the gap, or attempt legalese to justify the gap. No, He wants someone to actually stand in the gap between the living and the dead to perhaps give God a reason to show mercy when our abominations like child sacrifice, the shedding of innocent and parading our sin like Sodom deserve His just judgment.
Jeremiah 5:1 highlights this same Biblical principle, “Run to and fro through the streets of Jerusalem; See now and know; And seek in her open places if you can find a man, if there is anyone who executes judgment, who seeks the truth, and I will pardon her.”
Perhaps, America is not a burning ember yet due to some who have faithfully sought to live out this Biblical ethic in our nation today. And though you may consider those who do such things, criminals, at the Supreme Bar of Justice in heaven (Which we will all stand before to give an account), it has the potential to deliver our nation from evil and the divine retribution it so richly deserves.
9. Describe with specificity your understanding of what it means to make up the hedge, in the context of ending abortion, and identify any actions taken at or near EMW, on May 13, 2017, which exemplified your understanding of making up the hedge, in the context of ending abortion.
ANSWER: Same as previous answer, since Biblically, they are connected.
10. Describe with specificity your understanding of the Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrate, identify how it applies to ending abortion, and identify any actions taken in 2017, which exemplified your understanding of the application of the Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrate in Kentucky.
ANSWER: Though I have briefly touched on this in my other answers, this will be more specific. Before I do, it is necessary to set up the history why this doctrine is critical to our survival as a nation.
At our founding, our Founding Fathers gave us a Representative Republic based upon Federalism. It was the states that created the federal government with enumerated and limited powers and not the federal government that establish the states. The hierarchy of authority was We the People, the States, and last of all, the Federal Government. Rulers governed by the consent of the governed. This was a novel idea in world history. Since the Civil War and Reconstructionism, however, our government structure has been turned upside down.
Today, the hierarchy of authority is the Federal Government, the States, which have become mere provinces of Washington DC, and lastly, We the People. Due to the Supreme Court writing powers unto themselves forbidden by the Constitution and exploiting the Supremacy Clause of the Constitution, our nation has arrived at this pathetic state. This leads to the definition of the Lesser Magistrate and its vital importance to secure a future and a hope for our people.
The Lesser Magistrate Doctrine teaches that when the superior or higher ranking civil authority (Federal Government, specifically, the Supreme Court) makes immoral, unjust, and unconstitutional laws or policies, the lower or lesser ranking civil authority (Governors, State Legislators, Sheriffs, Chief of police, etc.) have both a right and duty to refuse obedience to that superior authority. If necessary, the lesser authorities may even actively resist the higher authority.
This doctrine is not new. It was even upheld by pagans in antiquity. “Use this sword against my enemies, if I give righteous commands; but if I give unrighteous commands, use it against me” (Roman Emperor Trajan). It was formalized as a Christian doctrine by the pastors in Magdeburg Germany on April 13th, 1550 AD. It is called The Magdeburg Confession.
This doctrine influenced other Reformers like John Knox from Scotland. He wrote a treatise to the Scottish Nobles to resist the tyranny of the King of England. It is called Appellation to the Nobility and Estates of Scotland. In this important historical work, Knox cited over 70 passages of Holy Scripture to prove the doctrine to be sound in Holy Writ.
Closer to home, I had the honor to serve our country with the 101st Airborne Division from 1974-1975. We were drilled to obey all lawful orders, even to the point of death if need be. Conversely, we were also drilled that we were not to obey unlawful orders for that could lead to war related atrocities. This is a part of our American DNA.
Without this understanding of the Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrate there is no America and we are a rouge nation that is in rebellion against England to this day. Our Founding Fathers look to the Laws of Nature and Nature’s God as justification to break ties with tyranny to become a free and independent nation. This doctrine gave us our nation and this doctrine must be applied to preserve our nation.
I highly recommend two books on these important topics. They are The Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates and The Magdeburg Confession. They are both written by Pastor Matt Trewhella. This court will not understand our rhetoric or actions until this court comprehends the Biblical, historical and constitutional grid that motivates our vision and guides our activities.
11. Identify all forms of social media used by you, from January 1, 2017 through present, and for each site for social media identified, please identify all user profiles utilized by you on said site; the name under which your account (if applicable) was opened; the e-mail address(es) used by you in relation to said site; and specify the names of the websites, web addresses, and social media profiles utilized.
ANSWER: OSA is not a clandestine operation, but a public proclamation. OSA uses Email contacts, firstname.lastname@example.org, our website, www.operationsaveamerica.org, Facebook Page, https://www.facebook.com/operationsaveamerica.org/, Twitter account, Username: OperationSaveAm, Instagram, operationsaveamerica. We also have a youtube channel, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP1EGTi_MAKbd-iNRvKABlA
To my knowledge, none of these were used to promote the incident in question. I did make use of these social media venues afterwards, however, to spread our message and make a defense of our actions taken on May, 13, 2017. All the videos and teachings can be accessed at https://operationsaveamerica.org/louisville-rescue/.
12. Identify whether donations were received by you or Operation Save America, for the period of time between January 1, 2017 through the present, and identify the amount of funds donated, on a monthly basis.
ANSWER: It is important that I be upfront with this court. If you are going to use any information about income to determine how much to fine me, if found guilty, I cannot in good conscience willingly pay one red cent, if that money goes to EMW to support their grisly trade.
13. Beginning after your May 13, 2017 arrest and lasting through the present, identify with specificity any instance when you considered engaging in the following at or near EMW:
a. the Doctrine of Interposition, as you described it in your response to Interrogatory #6;
b. rescue, as you described it in your response to Interrogatory #7;
c. standing in the gap, as you described it in your response to Interrogatory #8;
d. making up the hedge, as you described it in your response to Interrogatory #9;
e. the Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrate, as you described it in your response
to Interrogatory #10; and
f. blocking a patient or provider’s ability to enter or exit EMW, in order to prevent an abortion from occurring.
ANSWER: Hopefully, my previous answers are sufficient.
14. Identify with specificity whether you would, in the future, consider engaging in actions described in Interrogatory Requests #13(a)-(f), above.
ANSWER: When it comes to abortion and sodomy our federal government defends the indefensible. It violates its God ordained authority by protecting murderers and punishing Christians who seek peaceably save innocent lives. Instead of caring for human life and not its destruction, which Thomas Jefferson taught, “was the one and only object of good government” our government calls good, evil and evil, good. It has codified evil into “law.”
In essence, the federal government is responsible for a two-fold abomination articulated in Proverbs 17:15, which states, “He who justifies the wicked, and he who condemns the just, both of them alike are an abomination to the LORD.” It is the premise of these two abominations that has led this court to charge us with F.A.C.E.
The Rescue movement was powerfully used by God to shut down several death camps polluting and defiling our land. It saved thousands of lives and many in the death industry repented and came to the saving grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ.
In fact, arguably the three most influential people used to unleash the plague of abortion upon America, Norma McCorvey, the Jane Roe of Roe vs. Wade, Dr. Bernard Nathanson, founder of NARAL, and Sandra Cano, defendant in the Doe vs. Bolton case, which “legalized” abortion till the ninth month, all repented. They came to Christ for the forgiveness of their sins and used the rest of their lives to undo the lie of abortion they started. All of them were influenced by the efforts of our ministry. Rescue produced the good fruit of repentance for our national sin that has brought national calamity.
How did our federal government respond to this righteous response to the American holocaust? It went after us with R.I.C.O., which eventually failed and then it passed F.A.C.E. This draconian “law” takes a misdemeanor charge of trespass and metes out federal penalties.
This brings up serious questions that get to the crux of the matter in answering your question. What happens when a nation abandons God? What happens to a government when it calls evil, good and good, evil and then codifies that evil into law? What happens when the Supreme Court under the color of law unleashes lawlessness upon the land? What does this look like in the real world?
This case reveals what happens. You have 10 gentle Christians who merely sat down on a sidewalk. There was no destruction of property. There was not a hint of violence and yet these 10 will appear before this court charged with a crime and can face significant penalties. Compare that to the culture of death the lawlessness that the federal judiciary has produced to savage our nation.
There has been rioting, looting, statues torn down, buildings set on fire, and cars over turned. How does this same government respond to real crimes, violence, and destruction? It stands down and no criminal is brought to justice. This is what happens when a government defends the indefensible.
So to answer, your question, your draconian F.A.C.E. “law” crushed rescue as a tactic that saved many lives, but as a witness to our culture of death it is always viable. Jesus declared, “Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one’s life for his friends” (John 15:13).
Ultimately, there were two purposes for the “rescue” on May 13th. First, we desired to be a witness to love our neighbor as ourselves. Second, we sat down on a sidewalk to demonstrate to Gov. Bevin and the civil magistrates of Kentucky what the doctrine of interposition looks like at the church level and to use that to spur them to do their duty before God to interpose at the state level.
REQUEST FOR PRODUCTION OF DOCUMENTS
1. Produce all documents, which refer, reflect, relate to, support, or upon which you relied to supply your answers to your interrogatories and claims made in this action.
RESPONSE: The Bible and the teaching of the doctrines of interposition and the lesser magistrate. These are the standards that Christian men have followed down through the ages: “When the State commands us to do what God forbids or forbids us to do what God commands – we are to obey God rather than man.”
The following is our official video covering the rescue. Soon, we will find out if we remain the Lord’s freemen or become the Lord’s prisoner. Your prayers are welcomed and needed in Jesus’ name!